Shipper hate. It's like racism, in a way!
Nov. 21st, 2008 01:48 amA comment I just saw in
fandom_secrets (bolding is mine):
I have to admit, I'm glad that it seems the super-teeny-boppers are leaving (because honestly, that's the only thing I consider an absolute sign of a fairweather fan--leaving when the hawtness is gone), if only because maybe, in a few years, people who actually liked the Doctor/Rose ship will no longer be so vilified.
...
Hey, America elected a black President! I can dream that one day Classic!Who fans will no longer hate more for loving my ship unapologetically!
WHAT.
You did NOT just go there.
WTF. WTF.
Also, what the HELL, Ripway?! You bastards, I have not been online ALL GODDAMN DAY, I have NOT exceeded my fucking bandwidth! I'm looking straight at my damn account summary: I've used 19% of my available bandwidth, and I'm only using a third of my storage space, so STOP doing this to me. JESUS.
![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
I have to admit, I'm glad that it seems the super-teeny-boppers are leaving (because honestly, that's the only thing I consider an absolute sign of a fairweather fan--leaving when the hawtness is gone), if only because maybe, in a few years, people who actually liked the Doctor/Rose ship will no longer be so vilified.
...
Hey, America elected a black President! I can dream that one day Classic!Who fans will no longer hate more for loving my ship unapologetically!
WHAT.
You did NOT just go there.
WTF. WTF.
Also, what the HELL, Ripway?! You bastards, I have not been online ALL GODDAMN DAY, I have NOT exceeded my fucking bandwidth! I'm looking straight at my damn account summary: I've used 19% of my available bandwidth, and I'm only using a third of my storage space, so STOP doing this to me. JESUS.
Y'know, once upon a time I truly didn't care who won the American election. (And by "once upon a time," I mean a few months ago.) I was fairly mystified by the ENORMOUS issue it has been on my friendslist. I honestly couldn't figure out why people were getting so worked up about it; I suppose that, post-Bush, people only want the best person they can in office. Yet I thought perhaps we ought to be celebrating more Bush's removal, and the strong possibility of ANY Democratic candidate winning. C'mon guys,, I thought, What on earth happened to, "Anyone But Bush?" Who remembers that?
I would have been fine, at that point, with either Obama or Hillary. Hillary in particular, as I prayed for years that she would run when the time came. The Clintons back in office? Seemed like a good idea to me.
At this point though, everything I've heard and read about Hillary's campaign has left SUCH a bitter taste in my mouth that, were I American and Obama was not an option, I don't believe I could bring myself to vote AT ALL. Her campaign thus far has exposed her as entitled, hypocritical, viciously back-stabbing and a sore loser. I'm far from impressed. Her behaviour has been deplorable. I'm deeply, DEEPLY disappointed in her - in a woman who I thought had backbone, who was worth admiring.
The Wright issue is the absolute FINAL STRAW for me. Tell me - tell me! - what the HELL is wrong with what this man is saying?!
I wanted to stand up and CHEER when I watched this, and if you didn't too, then tell me WHY.
And this, what's terribly wrong with this? What's terribly wrong with condemning the systematic racism of the country you live in?
Others besides me have said it all better, so I'm just going to link:
First, a very long article by Tim Wise, but worth the read if you found Wright's comments, well, shocking:
So that's the truth of the matter: Wright made one comment that is highly arguable, but which has also been voiced by white America's favorite black man, another that was horribly misinterpreted and stripped of all context, and then another that was demonstrably accurate. And for this, he is pilloried and made into a virtual enemy of the state[...]
An Open Letter To Senator Clinton From A Diverse Group of Religious Leaders.
There are those among us who support Rev. Wright and believe his comments were deeply misconstrued. There are others among us who reject his words outright, even in context.
But across these lines, we stand together, White and Black, Protestant and Catholic, Christian and Jew.
No candidate should use religion as a tool to divide the American people, as you have done today.
And finally, the thing that inspired this post: a few words from the current pastor of Hillary Clinton's former church (BEST. THING. EVER.):
"The Reverend Jeremiah Wright is an outstanding church leader whom I have heard speak a number of times. He has served for decades as a profound voice for justice and inclusion in our society. He has been a vocal critic of the racism, sexism and homophobia which still tarnish the American dream. To evaluate his dynamic ministry on the basis of two or three sound bites does a grave injustice to Dr. Wright, the members of his congregation, and the African-American church which has been the spiritual refuge of a people that has suffered from discrimination, disadvantage, and violence. Dr. Wright, a member of an integrated denomination, has been an agent of racial reconciliation while proclaiming perceptions and truths uncomfortable for some white people to hear. Those of us who are white Americans would do well to listen carefully to Dr. Wright rather than to use a few of his quotes to polarize. This is a critical time in America's history as we seek to repent of our racism. No matter which candidates prevail, let us use this time to listen again to one another and not to distort one another's truth."
(bolds mine)
Have at it, then. If you agree Wright's sermons are vile, please explain.
(Also, why is "Obama" not in lj's spellcheck at this point? Don't they ever update this thing?)
I would have been fine, at that point, with either Obama or Hillary. Hillary in particular, as I prayed for years that she would run when the time came. The Clintons back in office? Seemed like a good idea to me.
At this point though, everything I've heard and read about Hillary's campaign has left SUCH a bitter taste in my mouth that, were I American and Obama was not an option, I don't believe I could bring myself to vote AT ALL. Her campaign thus far has exposed her as entitled, hypocritical, viciously back-stabbing and a sore loser. I'm far from impressed. Her behaviour has been deplorable. I'm deeply, DEEPLY disappointed in her - in a woman who I thought had backbone, who was worth admiring.
The Wright issue is the absolute FINAL STRAW for me. Tell me - tell me! - what the HELL is wrong with what this man is saying?!
I wanted to stand up and CHEER when I watched this, and if you didn't too, then tell me WHY.
And this, what's terribly wrong with this? What's terribly wrong with condemning the systematic racism of the country you live in?
Others besides me have said it all better, so I'm just going to link:
First, a very long article by Tim Wise, but worth the read if you found Wright's comments, well, shocking:
So that's the truth of the matter: Wright made one comment that is highly arguable, but which has also been voiced by white America's favorite black man, another that was horribly misinterpreted and stripped of all context, and then another that was demonstrably accurate. And for this, he is pilloried and made into a virtual enemy of the state[...]
An Open Letter To Senator Clinton From A Diverse Group of Religious Leaders.
There are those among us who support Rev. Wright and believe his comments were deeply misconstrued. There are others among us who reject his words outright, even in context.
But across these lines, we stand together, White and Black, Protestant and Catholic, Christian and Jew.
No candidate should use religion as a tool to divide the American people, as you have done today.
And finally, the thing that inspired this post: a few words from the current pastor of Hillary Clinton's former church (BEST. THING. EVER.):
"The Reverend Jeremiah Wright is an outstanding church leader whom I have heard speak a number of times. He has served for decades as a profound voice for justice and inclusion in our society. He has been a vocal critic of the racism, sexism and homophobia which still tarnish the American dream. To evaluate his dynamic ministry on the basis of two or three sound bites does a grave injustice to Dr. Wright, the members of his congregation, and the African-American church which has been the spiritual refuge of a people that has suffered from discrimination, disadvantage, and violence. Dr. Wright, a member of an integrated denomination, has been an agent of racial reconciliation while proclaiming perceptions and truths uncomfortable for some white people to hear. Those of us who are white Americans would do well to listen carefully to Dr. Wright rather than to use a few of his quotes to polarize. This is a critical time in America's history as we seek to repent of our racism. No matter which candidates prevail, let us use this time to listen again to one another and not to distort one another's truth."
(bolds mine)
Have at it, then. If you agree Wright's sermons are vile, please explain.
(Also, why is "Obama" not in lj's spellcheck at this point? Don't they ever update this thing?)
Bad comm! No biscuit!
Feb. 8th, 2008 03:58 amFor any members (present or future) of
debunkingwhite -
stoneself has posted a great article on the purpose of the community:
What I Think debunkingwhite Is About.
Sample quote:
debunkingwhite is about debunking white.
[...]
--
Related thought: some of the things people say in
debunkingwhite, ostensibly to demonstrate their willingness to engage the ideas and the discussion, are so goddamned obnoxious!
I mean really, INTENSELY butt-licking obnoxious. SCREAMING for praise and pats on the head. For example:
*shuts up and goes back to learning*
...Okay?! Do you want your Good White Person sash badge now? Jesus. WTF.
And I keep mentally debating. Should I say something when I see this nonsense? Am I sure it's always as obsequious as it sounds, or am I making excuses for people if I think perhaps in an effort to sound like they were listening, they worded it badly?
Would it actually help things along to say something, or is that just an inevitable stage that every white anti-racist moves through? Is there a way to point it out without having someone who is tentatively becoming more involved in the discussion decide the community is "mean" and "jumps on everything" and withdraw?
GAH.
(And oh my GOD, I've had this stupid headache for HOURS now, and it won't GO AWAY. *snarls*)
![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
What I Think debunkingwhite Is About.
Sample quote:
debunkingwhite is about debunking white.
[...]
- not about highlighting white anti-racism.
debunkingwhite is not the place for white people looking for cookies. no one here is going to hand you a cookie for your "good" anti-racist behavior. and again, just because debunkingwhite isn't about rewarding people for anti-racist behavior, doesn't mean the people here don't see your anti-racist behavior.
if you really need a group for that, i suggest you go create cookies4antiracistwhites.
--
Related thought: some of the things people say in
![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
I mean really, INTENSELY butt-licking obnoxious. SCREAMING for praise and pats on the head. For example:
*shuts up and goes back to learning*
...Okay?! Do you want your Good White Person sash badge now? Jesus. WTF.
And I keep mentally debating. Should I say something when I see this nonsense? Am I sure it's always as obsequious as it sounds, or am I making excuses for people if I think perhaps in an effort to sound like they were listening, they worded it badly?
Would it actually help things along to say something, or is that just an inevitable stage that every white anti-racist moves through? Is there a way to point it out without having someone who is tentatively becoming more involved in the discussion decide the community is "mean" and "jumps on everything" and withdraw?
GAH.
(And oh my GOD, I've had this stupid headache for HOURS now, and it won't GO AWAY. *snarls*)
Holy sh... Racism drama!
Dec. 13th, 2005 10:47 amWOW. SO MUCH DRAMA in lj-land last night. I didn't get any schoolin' done.
So...people outside of
feminist have been complaining for ages that the community lets white privilege run unchecked, and that it's exclusionary to women of color. The mods decide to fix this.
welsey makes a mod post explaining the new rules.
Based on some feedback, here are definitions of racism and sexism as we are using them. We are aware of the dictionary definition; however, we have chosen to use this definition because it is commonly used in anti-racist and social justice communities, and we ask that you also use it while you are in our space. More clarification may be added later:
racism = prejudice + power
sexism = prejudice + power
We separate these things from prejudice because the implications of racism and sexism (as we define them) are so much more significant and powerful than those of prejudice.
[...]
Reverse racism is not a valid concept.
And
feminist go BOOM.
People disagree, whine, complain, and just generally miss the entire point.
I replied, basically telling the mods pip-pip and good job, and I was sorry they were taking so much crap from the uninformed. I should have realized that would cause a shitload of drama, but didn't really. That also went BOOM.
(Can anybody tell that I have very, very little patience? Yeah. I think I really got off on the wrong foot with the "dingdingding" comment, but really...when someone says that OMG! You're calling all the [white, because that's what I meant] people who disagree with anti-racism rules racist! the snark just tends to come out.)
They're/we're up to 700 comments now. I started replying because I said that I did not want to leave the mods fighting this one alone. I am almost sorry at this point; my inbox is pleading with me to stop, so I'm mostly going to bow out and see how it plays.
Over on journalfen, OTF_Wank is having a real laugh at our expense.
(First comment: "
beandelphiki is a moron." I think I also got called a "Feminazi," the logic of which makes my brain hurt. I thought that if I ever got called THAT, it would be for arguing hard-line pro-choice or something, not critical race theory. OKAY!)
More fallout:
blackfolk: Nice try guys, but you still SUCK.
sex_and_race/
feminist_rage: See, this is why we're all in HERE, instead of over THERE. (Idiots.)
ap_racism: Okay, nothing yet, but I'm waiting on the "GAAAH!" reaction. SOMEBODY will say something, I'm sure.
*sits and looks at this mess*
You know, I think it's a good thing I will be busy working a lot during Christmas, and staying (for the most part) far away from lj. MY BRAIN.
Edit: Yes, I'm white. Jeebus. (And if you don't know why I added this, don't worry, just ignore.)
So...people outside of
![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
Based on some feedback, here are definitions of racism and sexism as we are using them. We are aware of the dictionary definition; however, we have chosen to use this definition because it is commonly used in anti-racist and social justice communities, and we ask that you also use it while you are in our space. More clarification may be added later:
racism = prejudice + power
sexism = prejudice + power
We separate these things from prejudice because the implications of racism and sexism (as we define them) are so much more significant and powerful than those of prejudice.
[...]
Reverse racism is not a valid concept.
And
![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
People disagree, whine, complain, and just generally miss the entire point.
I replied, basically telling the mods pip-pip and good job, and I was sorry they were taking so much crap from the uninformed. I should have realized that would cause a shitload of drama, but didn't really. That also went BOOM.
(Can anybody tell that I have very, very little patience? Yeah. I think I really got off on the wrong foot with the "dingdingding" comment, but really...when someone says that OMG! You're calling all the [white, because that's what I meant] people who disagree with anti-racism rules racist! the snark just tends to come out.)
They're/we're up to 700 comments now. I started replying because I said that I did not want to leave the mods fighting this one alone. I am almost sorry at this point; my inbox is pleading with me to stop, so I'm mostly going to bow out and see how it plays.
Over on journalfen, OTF_Wank is having a real laugh at our expense.
(First comment: "
![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
More fallout:
![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-community.gif)
*sits and looks at this mess*
You know, I think it's a good thing I will be busy working a lot during Christmas, and staying (for the most part) far away from lj. MY BRAIN.
Edit: Yes, I'm white. Jeebus. (And if you don't know why I added this, don't worry, just ignore.)